tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1442827238174603755.post5399268035556358769..comments2023-09-11T08:30:08.843-07:00Comments on Life Training Institute Blog: Must We Convert the Culture to Christianity to End Abortion?SKhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01905606527143286458noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1442827238174603755.post-52011903525537099902016-10-04T01:07:30.830-07:002016-10-04T01:07:30.830-07:00I didn't really read "anonymous'"...I didn't really read "anonymous'" comment. If someone isn't willing to stand behind their words, I don't generally take the time to read a lengthy comment. Plus, as you pointed out, this person is making an awful lot of assumptions about what I said and is generally wrong about all of them.Clinton Wilcoxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17018335374680419858noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1442827238174603755.post-25689634145745032682016-10-03T21:09:26.648-07:002016-10-03T21:09:26.648-07:00Did Jesus have a religious argument for pharisees ...Did Jesus have a religious argument for pharisees and another one for harlots and publicans? You make no sense. Why is murder wrong? Because God said so. Why do we care? Because we believe heaven or hell awaits us (prots believe they can sin boldly and still go to heaven as long as they believe even more boldly so not sure why they would worry about abortion-- which is why most don't).<br /><br />Criminalizing abortion must be more important than sharing the Gospel because to win non-believers he will not share the Gospel to change their mind on abortion (what is more important: their soul or abortion?). <br /><br />"there is a difference between asking a person to pray for you and praying to a saint." One asks a saint to pray for one (intercede)--the way the Blessed (all generations shall call me blessed) Virgin interceded w/her Son at the wedding feast at Cana. How bitter it must be to her & the Trinity that Prots won't even consider her as a role model--and what a tragedy for Prot women (who only have the co-pastor man role to usurp). <br /><br />http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/marydevotion.htm<br /><br />Are you a disciple whom Jesus' loves? Have you been at the foot of the cross w/Jesus and His mother? Then hear His words: "When Jesus therefore had seen his mother and the disciple standing whom he loved, he saith to his mother: Woman, behold thy son. After that, he saith to the disciple: Behold thy mother. And from that hour, the disciple took her to his own." <br /> <br />Again as Campion asked the prots: If we are ALL priests, then why aren't we ALL kings? In Fr. Luther's time, priests were not married--they also performed sacrifices on altars--since Fr. Luther not so much (but now 500 years later human sacrifices and Christians murdering their own kin (parents/children) thousands of times every day--legalized--w/the support of most of the sects Luther spawned (not Jesus' fruit to my mind). <br /><br />Jesus wasn't married. Concurrent w/married "ministers" vs unmarried priests was acceptance of divorce (sexual immorality). Also removing Mary as role model for women (mother and virgin) left only wife--which gave rise to old maid, emph on sex (must be attractive to get any power at all) and complete dependence on men--which of course (just like slavery) ended up w/women's lib from the Prot Bible--which has brought about abortion. <br /><br />"For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother's womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it." "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd giveth his life for his sheep." <br /><br />"The unmarried man is concerned about the work of the Lord, how he can please the Lord; but the married man is concerned about the affairs of this world, how he can please his wife, and his interests are divided. <br /><br />Catholic teaching on abortion which Ireland has now overthrown: "There are two questions at issue here. One is medical (Is there ever need for an abortion to save the mother's life?) and the other is moral (Would an abortion in that case be justified?) The answer to both questions is no. There is no medical situation whose only solution is a direct abortion, as many doctors have testified. Morally speaking, furthermore, it is never right to directly kill an innocent person, even if good results are foreseen. We do not say that a baby's life is more important than the mother's. We do say that they are equal. You may never directly kill either one of them. If, in spite of the best medical efforts, one or both of them die, nothing morally wrong has been done, because an effort has been made to save life, but has failed. That is far different from killing." <br />http://www.priestsforlife.org/questions/questionsandanswers.htm<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1442827238174603755.post-41824354714822053062016-10-03T20:00:26.205-07:002016-10-03T20:00:26.205-07:00Really the best option to avoid turning anyone off...Really the best option to avoid turning anyone off is to avoid taking sides but to be pro-choice. Educate means giving both sides and letting people make up their own minds. God isn't really an argument, is He? <br /><br />Georgetown has the right idea: Let Cecile Richards preach Abortion is a basic human right (for the baby, really?)<br />http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/04/22/cecile-richards-jesuit-georgetown-abortion-basic-human-right/<br /><br />Or the Catholic Center at U of Maryland--Why prochoice?<br />https://www.facebook.com/catholicterps/photos/a.10150357223759210.369820.77807544209/10154046083394210/?type=3&theater<br /><br />Both views are equal:<br />https://www.facebook.com/events/813604305432161/<br /><br />It's not abortion that's the problem, it's prolifers being negative--Joe Biden plagiarizer & John Boehner, alcoholic, love each other: it's negative prolifers who want to criminalize abortion who are the problem: "Biden, Boehner lament negative politics in Notre Dame addresses"<br />http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/15/politics/joe-biden-john-boehner-notre-dame/<br /><br />Prolifers have got to have their single issue free speech blocked, like at Fordham University:<br />"We were also told that the protesters physically blocked all the entrances of the building where the screening was held. We found out after the film that students who went to go watch it turned around when they saw the protesters."<br />http://studentsforlife.org/surprise-surprise-another-catholic-university-fails-its-pro-life-students/<br /><br />Or at DePauw U where the prolife students are punished for exposing the pro-abort vandals:<br />https://www.thefire.org/cases/depaul-university-student-punished-for-exposing-vandals-of-pro-life-display/<br /><br />French gvmt announces plan to criminalize websites opposing abortion<br />https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/french-gvmt-intends-to-obstruct-websites-offering-negative-information-abou<br /><br />California forces prolife groups to promote abortion<br /><br />http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/07/ca-pro-life-centers-fight-law-forcing-them-to-post-abortion-message/<br /><br />http://www.lifenews.com/2016/06/24/pregnancy-center-will-defy-new-california-law-forcing-centers-to-promote-abortions/<br /><br />Leave God out. He turns people off. And besides you might get your 501c status revoked. Just be reasonable. And the Sex Nazis won't kill you--unless you're a baby. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1442827238174603755.post-21621102363773205572016-10-03T19:59:15.319-07:002016-10-03T19:59:15.319-07:00"finally Ireland legalized abortion"
In..."finally Ireland legalized abortion"<br /><br />In cases of threat to the mother's life, yes. But this seems justifiable given double effect reasoning. Though, I'm not quite pleased with the exception for suicide. There seems a way to ensure that both live, and as such I'm not sure that there is a proportionate reason to justify abortion.<br /><br />"Religious leaders won't even preach against abortion (not to mention birth control) lest their flocks turn on them."<br /><br />Very true for a greater portion, no doubt, but this is also decried by many, including those "so-called Christians like you won't share the Gospel to avoid "turning people off" " (which I take you mean Clinton and perhaps LTI).<br /><br /> Besides that, I don't recall him saying that he won't share the Gospel to avoid turning people off, but that in the context of abortion he won't, at least in certain settings. But he, and this group are for using religious arguments on religious people, and all for defending the rationality of theism and then various specific Christian claims, to create a climate where various traditional moral views can be defended more successfully. In any event, it is not uncharitable to characterize them as you do.<br /><br />"You say criminalizing abortion is more important than living the Gospel."<br /><br />I don't recall him saying that. Or are you rushing to judgement? But it is said, 'Responding to a matter before he hears it is foolish and humiliating.'<br /><br />"but they can't ask the Blessed Virgin Mary to intercede for them."<br /><br />Perhaps that's because there is a difference between asking a person to pray for you and praying to a saint. The former is clearly described in Scirpture, but the latter is oddly absent.<br /><br />"ministers" can be married <br />As was Peter, as Paul says when he and Barnabas could be if they so chose.<br />Sean Killackeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08683592785735127212noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1442827238174603755.post-4798181725507807772016-10-03T16:20:51.139-07:002016-10-03T16:20:51.139-07:00What "atheist" state has criminalized ab...What "atheist" state has criminalized abortion? What most self-styled Christians don't realize is that THEY aren't Christian. U.S. isn't a Christian nation (as Obama pointed out)--no country is today (VC2 Church has de-Christianized every Catholic nation: finally Ireland legalized abortion and sodomite marriage). Britain hasn't been Christian since Protestant rebellion when King became head of the church. John the Baptist died over adultery. So did Thomas More and Edmund Campion (if all are priests, why aren't all Kings too?). <br /><br />http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/13133/pg13133-images.html<br /><br />What protestant doesn't hold that artificial birth control is moral? What Catholic Church enforces ban on birth control? What protestant doesn't believe in religious liberty (state over the church so as to escape the Pope)? That is the beginning of lawlessness: no divorce means divorce. U.S. must now acquiesce to Mormons and Muslims polygamy and child brides plus all manner of Indian witch doctors, voodoo, hindu suttee, etc. <br /><br />Women (and men) have been liberated from the Holy Bible. No longer do fathers/husbands govern their women (but give them a BC pill). Women don't remain silent and cover their heads in Church (or out), nor earn their salvation through child bearing. What protestant pastor doesn't have his wife co-pastoring his ministry? VC2 Pope Francis wants women leaders and admonishes his flock NOT to 'obsess' about abortion. Abortion must be legal to level the playing field and sodomite marriage must be legal because men and women are equal--contrary to Scripture states: God created them male and female; go forth be fruitful and multiply. "Blessed are all they that fear the Lord: that walk in his ways...Thy wife shall be as a fruitful vine by the sides of thine house: thy children like olive plants round about thy table." (indicates abortion is a punishment; what Christian considers a fruitful wife a blessing?) <br /><br />Criminalizing abortion via 'education'is a 501c dream of permanent tax free employment. It is like educating welfare recipients to vote against welfare. Religious leaders won't even preach against abortion (not to mention birth control) lest their flocks turn on them. Carly Fiona was pelted w/condoms by thugs hired by planned parenthood and who defended her? Trump is all over the map (but his VP is prolife!). Reagan, Bush et al were "prolife" but their wives while (maybe) personally against it, were pro-choice. If one could take the vote away from women perhaps one could criminalize abortion, but if women didn't have the vote, it would never have been legalized. <br /><br />I applaud those who are starting to look for a Christian solution; but considering their acceptance of religious liberty, divorce, contraception, women's equality and immodest dress--not to mention overthrow of the priesthood and holy sacrifice of the mass Christ established (just a supper not a sacrifice; don't have to give up your whole life to God, but "ministers" can be married (and divorced)), self-forgiveness of sins and compose one's own Bible. Also trashing of the Blessed Virgin Mary--protestants ask me to pray for them; Elijah and Moses come down to assist Jesus at the Transfiguration, but they can't ask the Blessed Virgin Mary to intercede for them--don't see much success crowning their effort. <br /><br />It's taken around 500 years to get from the protestant revolt to where so-called Christians like you won't share the Gospel to avoid "turning people off." (That was why John the Baptist failed w/Herod!) You say criminalizing abortion is more important than living the Gospel. Yet probably in a debate I could get you backing all over yourself about how much you luv wimmen and aren't anti-wimmen and wimmen are the victims. What do you really want--to be liked and salve your own conscience? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com